This is in response to a commenter on Elena's blog that my list of bullet points was incorrect and that I had been "misled"

Here are the points and my sources:

• Mormon doctrine denies the eternal nature of God (the father-god was a created man who became a god)

As god once was, man is. As God is, man may become." (See The Teachings of Lorenzo Snow, comp. Clyde J. Williams, Salt Lake City: Bookcraft, 1984, p. 1)

• Mormon doctrine denies the Trinity )"That these three are separate individuals, physically distinct from each other, is demonstrated by the accepted records of divine dealings with man." (Articles of Faith, by James Talmage, p. 35.)

Source: Joseph Smith: "Lectures on Faith.", approved for inclusion in the Doctrine and Covenants by a Conference vote of the LDS Church on August 17, 1835. They appeared in all English editions of the D&C until their unexplained removal in 1921 without a General Conference vote. Lecture Five explicitly teaches that there are two persons in the Godhead:

Q. How many personages are there in the Godhead?
A. Two: the Father and the Son.

• Mormon doctrine denies the virgin birth (the father-god had sex with Mary to conceive Jesus)

Brigham Young, second prophet and president of the LDS church said,

"The birth of the Saviour was as natural as are the births of our children; it was the result of natural action. He partook of flesh and blood—was begotten of his Father, as we were of our fathers." (Journal of Discourses, v. 8, p. 115).

• Mormon doctrine teaches that Christ was in a plural marriage

Jedediah M. Grant, Second Counselor to Brigham Young the Second Prophet of the LDS Church:

"Celsus was a heathen philosopher; and what does he say upon the subject of Christ and his Apostles, and their belief? He says, the 'grand reason why the Gentiles and philosophers of his school persecuted Jesus Christ, was because He had so many wives; there were Elizabeth, and Mary, and a host of others that followed Him.' After Jesus went from the stage of action, the Apostles followed the example of their master. . . The grand reason of the burst of public sentiment in anathemas upon Christ and his disciples, casing his crucifixion, was evidently based on polygamy,. . .a belief in the doctrine of plurality of wives caused the persecution of Jesus, and his followers. We might almost think they were 'Mormons' " (Journal of Discourses, Vol 1. ppl 345-346)

• Mormon doctrine teaches that Mormonism is the only true way to heaven
• Mormon doctrine states that there is no salvation without accepting Joseph Smith as a prophet of God, (Doctrines of Salvation, Vol. 1, p. 188.)

If it had not been for Joseph Smith and the restoration, there would be no salvation. There is no salvation [the context is the full gospel including exaltation to Godhood] outside the church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, (Mormon Doctrine, p. 670.)

• Mormon doctrine teaches that all men have the potential to become gods

As god once was, man is. As God is, man may become." (See The Teachings of Lorenzo Snow, comp. Clyde J. Williams, Salt Lake City: Bookcraft, 1984, p. 1)

• And it follows that Mormon doctrine denies monotheism (as there are as many gods as there are men who have become gods)

We were begotten by our Father in Heaven; the person of our Father in Heaven was begotten on a previous heavenly world by His Father; and again, He was begotten by a still more ancient Father, and so on from generation to generation, from one heavenly world to another still more ancient...
LDS Apostle Orson Pratt, The Seer, 1853, page 132

I was going to stay quiet but I just couldn't resist.

Marla Swoffer posted on being discerning about those who choose to call themselves Christians (namely Mormons).

A commenter on Marla blog commented: "I really cannot believe someone who would call themselves a Christian is so religious-racist, to coin a new phrase..."

Equating Godly discernment with racism may be...well, I'm not sure I have words...but let's have a look at some real religious-racism, Mormon style.

"Cain slew his brother. Cain might have been killed, and that would have put termination to that line of human beings. This was not to be and the Lord put a mark on him, which is the flat nose and black skin" Brigham Young (second prophet and President of the Mormon Church)

"Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be so." Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, Volume 10, page 110.

"Had I anything to do with the negro , I would confine them by strict law to their own species and put them on a national equalization.'' Joseph Smith (founder, first prophet and president of the Mormon Church), History of the Church, Volume 5, pages 218 - 219.

"Racial degeneration, resulting In differences In appearance and spiritual aptitude, has arisen since the fall. We know the circumstances under which the posterity of Cain (and later of Ham) were cursed with what we call negroid racial characteristics." Mormon Doctrine, page 616.

.As a result of his rebellion, Cain was cursed with a dark skin; he became the father of the negroes, and those spirits who are not worthy to receive the priesthood are born through his lineage." Mormon Doctrine, page 109.

To illustrate: Cain Ham, and the whole negro race have _ cursed with a black skin, the mark of Cain, so they can be identified as a caste apart, a people with whom the other descendants of Adam should not intermarry." Mormon Doctrine, page 114.

"Not only was Cain called upon to suffer, but because of his wickedness he became the father of an inferior race. A curse placed upon him and that curse has been continued through his lineage and must do so while time endures. Millions of souls have come into this world cursed with a black skin and have been denied the privilege of Priesthood and the fullness of the blessings of the Gospel. These are the descendants of Cain. Moreover, they have been made to feel their inferiority and have been separated from the rest of mankind from the beginning.... we will also hope that blessings may eventually be given to our negro brethren, for they are our brethren—children of God—not withstanding their black covering emblematical of eternal darkness. " The Way to Perfection, pages 101-102.

2/15/2006
I've been struggling/wrestling with this issue, give the stuff at my church plus a few of the blogs I read on a regular basis. It's going to take me a while to get through this. I welcome input and I think I'm going to keep everything in this one post, so that it's in one place. That means I'll have to try to update the date 😉

I've got
- "To be Continued?" by Samuel Waldron
- "Keep in Step With the Spirit" by J.I.Packer
- "Wind & Fire" (Ten sermons by C.H.Spurgeon)
- and articles found here.

I guess the short story is that I've experienced what some would call "prophetic words"; others would call them coincidence. I grew up with one of my mom's favorite hymn being "In the Garden"...you know..."and He walks with me and He talks with me...".

Does He? I know He walks with me...but does He talk with me?

Cessationists say, "NO!" Prayer is one-way communication.

Continued later...

I took these last night, just to see what my new digital camera could do at sunset.

I've done some pretty extensive studies on divorce and remarriage - at my age, there are not that many widowed guys and most (MOST) of the never married men are never married for a reason. Knowing where I stand on this issue was very important for me to figure out.

This particular post was prompted by a commenter on Challies who said, "The Levitical priests were not to marry a divorced woman because of defilement. Is that defilement not tied to sin?"

The actual quote from Leviticus 21 is:-15 " 'The woman he marries must be a virgin. He must not marry a widow, a divorced woman, or a woman defiled by prostitution, but only a virgin from his own people, so he will not defile his offspring among his people. I am the LORD, who makes him holy. ' "

Read this again. A priest had special prohibitions on who he could marry. Not only could he not marry a divorced woman, he could not marry a widow or a prostitute.

He had to marry a virgin. Period. It didn't matter what the reason for the woman's "non-virginity", a priest had to marry a virgin.

Next: the woman described as "defiled" was defiled by prostitution, not divorce. So, if a person wishes to import the "defilement" to divorced women as well, that person needs to import the "defilement" to widows as well.

So, I would ask, what sin in tied to being a widow, other than the sin of being married to a man who gets cancer and dies?

Another point is the status of divorced women.

Lev. 22: 12-13 If a priest's daughter marries anyone other than a priest, she may not eat any of the sacred contributions. But if a priest's daughter becomes a widow or is divorced, yet has no children, and she returns to live in her father's house as in her youth, she may eat of her father's food.

This is important to the "defiled by divorce" - in this passage, there is no difference in the "holiness" of a priests daughter, divorced or widowed, as it pertains to living in the priest's home or eating the sacred contributions.

There is no difference in status between a divorced woman or a widow.

Well...I do like writing...but at the rate I'm moving I'd get a PhD about the time I die.

You Should Get a PhD in Liberal Arts (like political science, literature, or philosophy)

You're a great thinker and a true philosopher. You'd make a talented professor or writer.

I am very disappointed in my church. After (what I thought was) a good meeting with my pastor, I get this letter from the youth ministries, telling us that our teens are going to be working with, staying with and worshipping with "Full-Gospel, Five-fold Ministry, Oneness Apostolic Anti-trinitarians."

The letter reads:

This fall we heard from our students a desire to help serve the people in the hurricane devastated Gulf Coast. Students wanted to do something, but didn't know what that would be.

Earlier this fall we began to pray about taking students to the Gulf Coast over spring break. Leaders and students were excited about this option and we connected with an organization called National Relief Network to make arrangements for work projects.

During the fall, Sunshine Church built a relationship with Firehouse Ministries in New Orleans. Several groups from our church have been able to clean and rebuild that church. Firehouse now stands as a lighthouse in their devastated neighborhood.

We are excited about the relationship that Sunshine has built with Firehouse and we are excited to announce that we have changed our plans and will now be working and staying at Firehouse Ministries.

THE PLAN...Sunday we will worship at Firehouse...

A Family Forever, by Brenda Coulter

Christian Fiction, published by Steeple Hill Love Inspired
Buy it in stores after February 29 or order it now on Amazon.com.
Visit Brenda's blog, No rules. Just write,

You can read most of the first chapter at Brenda's website.

I've said before that I don't read a lot of fiction, it's a treat when mind wants to read something I don't have to process. This book fit the bill. It's a very fast read (for me, anyway) so it exactly fit what I was looking for last night. Yes, I'd recommend it.

The book is filled with Christian values; un-perfect people fail and recognize their failings. Parts of it reached me deeply and I cried through some of it.

I enjoyed the book (and I don't generally read "romance" - I like murder mysteries), so please head on over and read the first chapter.

We have a few students out sick today and we ended up with 2 students and 4 staff. I went to help out in another room and it was nice to work with other folks. The people I work with are great, I just like to see new faces now and then. Most of the classrooms in the school I'm at are SXI - it made me think about Terri Schiavo and my durable power of attorney.

I'm reading a Q&A here. I'm taking it (and a beer) to bed with me, along with a highlighter. The whole cessationism thing is all getting fed into the hopper - we'll just have to wait to see what comes out.

By the way, my daughter is a barnacle, too.

I've got another little blog where I'm keeping track of my reading habits.

When I keep track of what I'm reading, should I include magazines? Textbooks?

I'm reviewing the books as I go along (link is in the sidebar) just to see at the end of the year what I really do read and how my habits are shaping up.

I used to be a big fiction fan and now fiction is more like "brain candy" when I want a break from stuff I have to think about.

Questions I'll try to remember to ask at the end of the year when I look at all the books"
- Are there more fiction books or non-fiction?
- Are there more theology books, or "other"
- Are the books I read more relevent to my own life or will they help me minister to others?
- Are the books primarily from one (Reformed) viewpoint, or am I using my discernment to evaluate other views?
- How has my reading changed my beliefs?
- Have I "picked up" any new favorite authors?
- Have my reading habits changed? How?